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Author Topic: King of Foxes  (Read 1708 times)

Hactar

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King of Foxes
« on: May 10, 2005, 02:07:24 PM »

Hi all,

I was wondering what you people think of King of Foxes. Personally I was very disapointed. First it took for ever for the book to come out in Paperback (and the local library didn't have the book in English) and then the book itself didn't measure up to my expectations. Don't you think that there are a couple of passages in the book there Talon just acts entirely unlogical? AAnd not just him, but the Duke as well

please tell me what you think about the book

Hactar

btw: how do I black out spoilers against this background?
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[span style=\'color:grey\']"Until you've been in politics you haven't been alive. It's rough and sometimes it's dirty and it's always hard work and tedious details. But it's the only sport for grownups. All other games are for kids. All of 'em." Dak Broadbent in Double Star - Robert A. Heinlein[/span]

Alrin

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King of Foxes
« Reply #1 on: May 10, 2005, 02:11:37 PM »

To black out spoilers....

Code: [Select]
[spoiler]Here is the spoiler[/spoiler] - [i]Author - The title of the book[/i]
Example :
Spoiler: show
Here is the spoiler
- Author - The title of the book



As for my opinion of KoF. Well, I was disappointed to say the least. I'd rate it barely above the Krondor books in terms of quality. There were so many inconsistencies. It's as if Ray got some one totally unfamiliar with every piece of his earlier works to write the book. I could go on, but i've said it all before. If you browse the boards a bit you'll find discussions about the Coonclave series.

ANyway. welcome aboard.
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Hactar

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King of Foxes
« Reply #2 on: May 10, 2005, 03:24:56 PM »

Ok, good; so it's not just me. I can not understand how such an outstanding novelist can write such a crappy book :(
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[span style=\'color:grey\']"Until you've been in politics you haven't been alive. It's rough and sometimes it's dirty and it's always hard work and tedious details. But it's the only sport for grownups. All other games are for kids. All of 'em." Dak Broadbent in Double Star - Robert A. Heinlein[/span]

TonyG

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King of Foxes
« Reply #3 on: May 10, 2005, 11:44:34 PM »

just like in any kind of work People have bad days, weeks etc, so i would assume so could feist.

personally i quite liked the book 2 of the conclave, but maybe reading all those tales of the riftwar books just before Starting the conclave series helped lower my expectations a bit :P

And yes i know Feist never wrote the tales of the riftwar books.
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Hactar

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King of Foxes
« Reply #4 on: May 11, 2005, 12:25:53 PM »

What is Exile's Return like? Compared to the other Conclave books, that is. Should I go and get it?
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[span style=\'color:grey\']"Until you've been in politics you haven't been alive. It's rough and sometimes it's dirty and it's always hard work and tedious details. But it's the only sport for grownups. All other games are for kids. All of 'em." Dak Broadbent in Double Star - Robert A. Heinlein[/span]

Alrin

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King of Foxes
« Reply #5 on: May 11, 2005, 12:26:58 PM »

Exile's is probably the best of the three.. but then I'm a Kaspar fan, so I'm biased.
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Great One

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King of Foxes
« Reply #6 on: May 11, 2005, 12:31:39 PM »

Yep, it's better than the three and a good book all round. Definetly worth reading....
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Hactar

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King of Foxes
« Reply #7 on: May 12, 2005, 11:46:54 AM »

excellent
that should make me happy again then :)
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[span style=\'color:grey\']"Until you've been in politics you haven't been alive. It's rough and sometimes it's dirty and it's always hard work and tedious details. But it's the only sport for grownups. All other games are for kids. All of 'em." Dak Broadbent in Double Star - Robert A. Heinlein[/span]

The Woodcutter

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King of Foxes
« Reply #8 on: May 12, 2005, 06:10:35 PM »

I didn't feel it was bad, but it seemed to lack the flare of other books.  Much better than MiL though.  That book had all the flash and sizzle of a UPS truck.  In the scheme of Conclave series, it is OK.
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Erik_De_Von_Loungeville

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King of Foxes
« Reply #9 on: May 16, 2005, 05:49:59 PM »

Just finished this one this morning.  I did not like the ending AT ALL.  I felt like I was reading a bad remake of the kings buccaneer.  There were some enjoyable parts to be sure, but for the most part, it was one of the least enjoyable books I've read from Ray.
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Valdek

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King of Foxes
« Reply #10 on: May 19, 2005, 08:07:46 PM »

Yea, KoF was pretty lame, on par with the Krondor series.  Glaring inconsistencies and more of the *omg I'm Talon and I can do anything and everything* bit...

Exile's Return is much better, as Talon falls to earth(meaning he quits doing everything) and the story is focused on a much more believeable, realistic character.
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ultimate_ed

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King of Foxes
« Reply #11 on: May 20, 2005, 02:36:36 AM »

Quote
Yea, KoF was pretty lame
[snapback]33106[/snapback]


I think that pretty nicely sums up my opinion of it as well.  Exile's return is a vast improvement.
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Hactar

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King of Foxes
« Reply #12 on: May 21, 2005, 04:12:41 PM »

Quote
Exile's Return is much better, as Talon falls to earth(meaning he quits doing everything) and the story is focused on a much more believeable, realistic character.

That sounds encouraging and disapointing at the same time. Initially I really liked talon. I just thought that the story of the first book should have been spread out over at least 3 books. Talon's develpment should have been spread out over as much material as the rising of Pug, in my opinion. In KoF he just fell of his throne imho and I will be forever sad.
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[span style=\'color:grey\']"Until you've been in politics you haven't been alive. It's rough and sometimes it's dirty and it's always hard work and tedious details. But it's the only sport for grownups. All other games are for kids. All of 'em." Dak Broadbent in Double Star - Robert A. Heinlein[/span]

Erod

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King of Foxes
« Reply #13 on: May 21, 2005, 11:39:19 PM »

Well, I did enjoy it as any other book by Feist (except maybe the Riftwar Legacy books). But then again, my opinion is heavily biased. Feist is a god after all :P.

On a side note, glad to find a forum with so much Feist stuff. Had to register instantly.
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Alrin

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King of Foxes
« Reply #14 on: September 27, 2006, 04:29:33 PM »

My turn to dust off an old thread.

After re-reading the Conclave series yet again, I'm of the opinion that a trilogy was a waste of paper, and simply a means to milk money from the fans. I think everyone would've been better served with a duology. Ray would've copped less flack from fans if he'd put out two longer books rather than three piddly little things. Furthermore, I think the story itself would've read better had the two parts of King of Foxes, Agent and Soldier respectively, been split, with each half going into the other titles in the series.

Spoiler: show
Talon could've joined Kaspar's service in Talon of the Silver Hawk, and we could've followed his journey up until he was sentenced to imprisonment.

Exile's Return could've then began with Talon in the Fortress of Despair and continued through to the end of the Exile's we know. (The title would've still worked, as at first the reader would be lead to believe Tal was the exile after his imprisonment, only to be surprised later by Kaspar's exile.)
- Conclave spoilers  

I, for one, would've preferred it that way, as I wouldn't feel as though I'd wasted $40 on a piece of s*** book.
« Last Edit: September 27, 2006, 04:37:19 PM by Alrin »
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Rhombaad

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King of Foxes
« Reply #15 on: September 27, 2006, 07:53:12 PM »

To be honest, I didn't think KoF was that bad.  I actually kind of enjoyed Conclave of Shadows, and I agree that Exile's Return was definitely the strongest of the three books.  After slugging through the crap that was Krondor: Tear of the Gods, Conclave of Shadows seemed to me to be a big improvement, as it felt a little more like Feist's earlier works.  I think you've got an interesting idea there, Al.  It certainly would have been less punishing on the wallet, and I think the story would have flowed just as well, if not better, with Conclave being a duology instead of a trilogy.
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Puc de Magiër

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King of Foxes
« Reply #16 on: September 27, 2006, 09:15:32 PM »

Just as Rhombaad, i don't think KoF is that bad a book, but what you say makes sence Alrin  the fact that I had to buy three instead of two books is not that important to me, but the logical and natural flow of the story is, and the way you describe it is very logical. Ofcourse, I must read the books again to have a more accurate opinion, so hang on in there and I'll tell you
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Liallan

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King of Foxes
« Reply #17 on: September 27, 2006, 10:58:53 PM »

KoF, paired in some regard with TotSH was my least favourite book.... I didn't read MiLM, you see, but afer the comments I'm not that anxious to. Tal was probably the first main character I encountered that I just couldn't care less about.
The flow Al suggested really appeals to me, for it would create major suspense in an otherwise boring book where you just couldn't wait for the next plot twist to bring about some change. However, a flow like Al suggested would probably be also extremely... um, evil...    
I just can't imagine what it would be like to be left hanging at the point where
Spoiler: show
Tal gets sent to prison and actually loses his hand. Although, now that I think of it, that's what Feist did to Magician: Apprentice, where Pug as a character simply disappears after he gets captured.
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Val

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King of Foxes
« Reply #18 on: October 04, 2006, 06:16:58 PM »

[!--quoteo--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE[/div][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--quotec--]with Conclave being a duology instead of a trilogy.[/quote]

Yes, and I believe that Alrin has also summed up the best points to make the cut off between them. Problem might be Ray's contract. By the speed the books are published these days and their decreasing length, it might well be that he has a contract with his publishers to deliver a book a year. Which obviously drags down the book a bit, especially in length (all after Serpentwar), and in some cases also in quality (latter Krondor books, Conclave). Even his latest, Into a Dark Realm - it was definitely his best effort since Rage of a Demon King - but I was still disappointed by the lack of length, which IMO in the latter parts also made the pace a little rushed.

Thus I don't believe that he himself is trying to milk out the fan, but that his publishers is.

As regards people's dislike of the Krondor books - I actually reasonably enjoyed Krondor: The Betrayal. It was a satisfactory book with some good characters. Krondor:The Assassins, was then a disappointment compared with the second. Not to speak of Krondor:Tear of the Gods - where it is currently undecided for me whether Tear of the Gods or King of Foxes marks his weakest effort in his entire career.

Luckily, though, as Flight of the Nighthawks and Into a Dark Realm showed, he has come back to produce quality books. Some authors never manage to - such as Terry Goodkind, whose first two Wizard's First Rule and Stone of Tears were fairly decent - but of the next 7 he wrote only a single one was a good book - Faith of the Fallen (book #6). And even with that one the minds are heated with debate, as people either absolutely love it or absolutely hate it. I liked it though, which is probably the only reason why I fought myself through the latter books.

I just hope that Ray has reasonable time to finish his further books, as the close deadlines they seem to set for seem to pull down some of his books.
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Arius Miura de Galdri

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King of Foxes
« Reply #19 on: October 04, 2006, 11:38:16 PM »

I don't necessarily think KoF was bad, but it did feel VERY rushed.  As to the comments about Talon, I thought he was an awesome character, probably my favorite from all of the Midkemia novels.
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