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Author Topic: The Lies of Macros the Black  (Read 2210 times)

Pugs First Apprentice

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The Lies of Macros the Black
« on: May 27, 2005, 06:57:34 PM »

I have been thinking about one event in the books latley, and this came about as i  reada bit of Darkness in a bookshop, just because i was bored :D

Macros told many a lie in his life this we know for sure. There is one in particular that is bugging me, wheather it was turth or a trick...This is from magican but i think it relates to all the Riftwar and some truths revealed in teh Serpantwar.

Spoiler: show


The moment i am talking about is When the Enemy, or the wonder Star, what ever it was, attacked Kelewan in the very distant past. When Pug was having his final Test on the Great Spire of the Academy of Magicans, he saw Macros aid the repulsion of the Enemy. Im am pretty sure this repulsion was at least a melenia before the present date. Thats a guess. But one thing i am pretty sure of is that it did not happen during Macros's Life time. In Rage of a Demon king Macros says he was...300?? 500?? years old. I cant remember exactly.

So, did he travel back in time to thwat the Enemy? Was he actually that old and i am forgeting facts about the book? Or was this a lie he planted into pugs Black Robe training?



Thats one lie/truth i am curious about. Anyone else who have any niggling doubts?
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Panopticon

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The Lies of Macros the Black
« Reply #1 on: May 27, 2005, 07:30:23 PM »

Quote
I have been thinking about one event in the books latley, and this came about as i  reada bit of Darkness in a bookshop, just because i was bored :D

Macros told many a lie in his life this we know for sure. There is one in particular that is bugging me, wheather it was turth or a trick...This is from magican but i think it relates to all the Riftwar and some truths revealed in teh Serpantwar.

Spoiler: show


The moment i am talking about is When the Enemy, or the wonder Star, what ever it was, attacked Kelewan in the very distant past. When Pug was having his final Test on the Great Spire of the Academy of Magicans, he saw Macros aid the repulsion of the Enemy. Im am pretty sure this repulsion was at least a melenia before the present date. Thats a guess. But one thing i am pretty sure of is that it did not happen during Macros's Life time. In Rage of a Demon king Macros says he was...300?? 500?? years old. I cant remember exactly.

So, did he travel back in time to thwat the Enemy? Was he actually that old and i am forgeting facts about the book? Or was this a lie he planted into pugs Black Robe training?



Thats one lie/truth i am curious about. Anyone else who have any niggling doubts?
[snapback]33914[/snapback]

i would like to comment:
Spoiler: show
i think it was a little of both. Pug needed to see it to complete his training and to be able to begin to understand everything that had to do with it. But I also think that it was some little bit if reality in it. Time travel is mentioned at least two times in the books (thomas/ashen shugar conversation, pug & co. travelling to the beginning), and that Macros sometime during his 300-500 year long life actually did this travel to make the future possible.


Or something like that.....it is hard to out ones thoughts about this into text.
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Ashen Shugar

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The Lies of Macros the Black
« Reply #2 on: May 27, 2005, 08:27:48 PM »

Spoiler: show
It's true, I remeber macros and pug talking about it. pug was commenting on the power needed to close....or divert that rift. and macros said "compared to this, that was easy" or something along those lines. so i think its true
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Alrin

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The Lies of Macros the Black
« Reply #3 on: May 28, 2005, 04:44:14 AM »

I'd say it was a case of time travel
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sabre

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The Lies of Macros the Black
« Reply #4 on: May 28, 2005, 05:26:22 AM »

I think he was actually there originally not by time travel.
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Alrin

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The Lies of Macros the Black
« Reply #5 on: May 28, 2005, 05:46:09 AM »

Spoiler: show
since in the version of Macros' history that he tells that Miranda actually approves he mentions he's about 500 years old, i don't think that's really possible is it? from memory, the events with the golden bridge and the Stranger took place well over 500 years before.
- Rage of a Demon King/Magician spoilers
« Last Edit: May 28, 2005, 05:47:30 AM by Alrin »
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toran

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The Lies of Macros the Black
« Reply #6 on: May 28, 2005, 08:54:43 AM »

well if it was time travel the question then becomes why would macros travel back? why would he be concerned or even know if it wasn't his home planet??? i would say he was there in the first place because i think too many questions are rased if he travelled back
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Alrin

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The Lies of Macros the Black
« Reply #7 on: May 28, 2005, 09:07:48 AM »

Why would he bother?
Spoiler: show
Because Kelewan was needed to bring Pug into power. Without his time on Kelewan he never would of come into his mantle of power in time to aid the Kindom.
- Riftwar spoilers
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Thant

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The Lies of Macros the Black
« Reply #8 on: May 28, 2005, 05:56:03 PM »

Spoiler: show

Well, who sais that he is not 500 years old and was there? Maybe he just traveled in the future?


 :scout:

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Great One

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The Lies of Macros the Black
« Reply #9 on: May 30, 2005, 03:45:43 AM »

To my recollection, where Macros actually originated from hasn't been clarified. Why not reveal this?
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Alrin

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The Lies of Macros the Black
« Reply #10 on: May 30, 2005, 04:32:07 AM »

Spoiler: show
Macros was born in Kesh approx. 500 years before Rage of a Demon King, at the height of the Empire's power.
- Macros/Rage of a Demon King spoilers
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Great One

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The Lies of Macros the Black
« Reply #11 on: May 30, 2005, 04:43:48 AM »

Ah yes....his family is mentioned as well. You have a better head for things Feist than I have, Al. :D
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Pugs First Apprentice

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The Lies of Macros the Black
« Reply #12 on: May 30, 2005, 06:11:52 AM »

Time Travel has ALWAYS bugged me and i dont enjoy it when Authors use it in there books. Can someone explain to me in terms i can understand how this is possible?

A man travels back in time to divert a powerful being that would have destroyed a planet. But it would have destroyed the planet before he was born so how can it still exist during his lifetime? *brain explodes*
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Ashen Shugar

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The Lies of Macros the Black
« Reply #13 on: May 30, 2005, 06:31:45 AM »

well, midkemia wasn't destroyed. so if he left from midkemia and went back in time ro kelewan then its possible. or if the god(s) reached into the future to bring him back in time.... which I think is more likely cos if it was the first one then the valheru would of already been in midkemia cos they are in the same dimension as kelewan......  i think

time travel always confuses me. cos if I am to time travel into the past in  30 years from now and change something, has it already happened?
 this could apply to macros if he was destined to go back in time and save kelewan even if he wasnt born yet, it kinda would of already happened cos..... k, fine I have no clue what I'm talking about.




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« Last Edit: May 30, 2005, 06:40:36 AM by Ashen Shugar »
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Panopticon

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The Lies of Macros the Black
« Reply #14 on: May 30, 2005, 08:39:45 AM »

Quote
Time Travel has ALWAYS bugged me and i dont enjoy it when Authors use it in there books. Can someone explain to me in terms i can understand how this is possible?

A man travels back in time to divert a powerful being that would have destroyed a planet. But it would have destroyed the planet before he was born so how can it still exist during his lifetime? *brain explodes*
[snapback]34121[/snapback]

a bit off-topic, but not: Stephen Hawkin has published a few interesting theories, and easy to understand, about time-travel. Search on the Internet or library for some of his work!
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mad_warlord

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The Lies of Macros the Black
« Reply #15 on: June 04, 2005, 01:50:34 AM »

lol!
this is all interesting but... what if, and i stress IF, macros looked EXACTLY like his father and his father stopped it???

just a theory here peoples
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Alrin

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« Reply #16 on: June 04, 2005, 02:15:49 AM »

from what i recall
Spoiler: show
Macros' father was a merchant or accountant or some such, and didn't have any magicial ability
- Rage of a Demon King/Macros Spoilers
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zeratulcraft

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The Lies of Macros the Black
« Reply #17 on: June 04, 2005, 03:10:38 PM »

Quote
Time Travel has ALWAYS bugged me and i dont enjoy it when Authors use it in there books. Can someone explain to me in terms i can understand how this is possible?

A man travels back in time to divert a powerful being that would have destroyed a planet. But it would have destroyed the planet before he was born so how can it still exist during his lifetime? *brain explodes*
[snapback]34121[/snapback]

Time Travel is indeed strange...but, say in that example, the planet was indeed saved BEFORE you were born. This of course makes it; The planet could only have been saved if it was never destroyed, since if it was destroyed this means you could not have been born to save it. This means that the planet would ALWAYS have been saved, just who did it is meaningless.
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Thant

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« Reply #18 on: June 04, 2005, 06:44:22 PM »

Well, if you follow what Z said, and think about ti a little more,

If you save a planet by time traveling, before you were born, this indeed means this was destined to happen. However, if you look from another point of view,

If a planet is saved by someone from the future, this means this person will have to come from the future, in other words, that the planet needed to eb saved in order to be saved. The only way this is possible, is if it was destined to happen. So, to round up my story, the only way time traveling can happen is if, and only if,  things are destined to happen.

If we live in a world where things are just happening, time traveling would be impossible.

 :scout:
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Darkon

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The Lies of Macros the Black
« Reply #19 on: June 04, 2005, 07:29:16 PM »

Quote
If we live in a world where things are just happening, time traveling would be impossible.

That would alter the future. Always no matter what you do.

Spoiler: show
I think Macros went back in time to be there and close the rift etc. etc. That or Pugs vision was manipulated.

- Macros, Riftwar spoiler
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